413: Ancestral Methods in Cider Making

413: Ancestral Methods in Cider Making

Author: Ria Windcaller: Award-winning Cidermaker, Podcaster | Craft Beer Columnist May 15, 2024 Duration: 1:09:14

Is Ancestral Method different than Pet Nat?

This panel discussion on Ancestral Method was moderate by Nicole Leibon of LeNosse Knows consultation. She was joined by Yann Gilles, a French cider consultant, Levi Danielson of Oregon's RAW cider and David Carr of California's Raging Cider. This feature was was recorded at CiderCon 2024, the annual trade conference hosted by the American Cider Association.

Cider Chat Episode 413 Full Ancestral Method panel
(ltor) Nicole LeGrand Liebon, Yann Gilles, Levi Danielson, Dave Carr

The discussion centers around various aspects of cider production, specifically highlighting traditional cider-making methods like the "ancestral method.

Topics discuss on this panel

  • Cider Making Methods and Personal Backgrounds of each speaker
  •  
  • Ancestral Method of Cider Production
    • This traditional method of cider making is particularly prominent in Normandy and Brittany, France.
    •  
    • It involves a two-step fermentation process:
      • the first step is in tanks and the second in bottles, intentionally leaving both fermentations incomplete to retain some natural sugars and create a sparkling cider.
  •  
  • Technical Details in Cider Fermentation
    • Discussions delve into the technical specifics such as controlling yeast population, managing nitrogen levels in the must, and how these factors affect the cider's quality and character.
  •  
  • Influence of Environmental Factors
    • Various environmental factors like orchard age, apple variety, and climatic conditions impact the nitrogen content in apples, which in turn affects the cider's fermentation process
  •  
  • Cider Quality Control Techniques
    •    Techniques like racking, filtration, and the use of centrifuges are explored to manage fermentation and ensure quality.
  •  
  • Packaging and Bottling Considerations
    •    The choice of bottles, pressure management during second fermentation, and how these factors impact the safety and quality of the final cider product are discussed

Cider Chat Episode 413 Ancestral Method Cider Tasted

  • Cider Tasting and Consumer Preferences
    • The session included a cider tasting, emphasizing the importance of understanding consumer preferences and the impact of specific cider-making techniques on the flavor and appeal of the cider.
      • 2022 Cidre AOP Pays d'Auge Cuvée Réserve | Manoir de Grandouet (Normandy)
      •  
      • 2023 AW Cider Pet Nat | RAW Cider Company (Oregon)
      •  
      • 2020 Disco Nat, Metal House Cider (New York)
      •  
      • Jonathan & Liberty | Raging Cider & Mead Company (California)

Enjoy this detailed exploration highlights both the science and the art behind cider making, from orchard management to bottling and consumer satisfaction.

Contact info for Ancestral Methods Panel

Mentions in this Cider Chat


There’s a whole world in a glass of cider, and Cider Chat is your invitation to explore it. Hosted by award-winning cidermaker and writer Ria Windcaller, this podcast travels far beyond the bottle to meet the people who make the global cider culture so vibrant. Each conversation is a journey-you might find yourself in a heritage orchard learning the history of forgotten apple varieties, in a bustling taproom with an importer explaining regional traditions, or in a kitchen with a chef pairing cider with unexpected foods. The discussions get into the delightful nuances, too, whether that’s the semantics of what we even call this drink or how the concept of terroir translates from soil to sip. It’s not just about production; it’s about the community, the travel, and the stories that fermentation unlocks. This is for anyone curious about the craft, history, and sheer enjoyment of fermented apple juice in all its forms. So, pour a glass and settle in for a series that feels like a wide-ranging, informative, and genuinely good-humored chat with friends who happen to be obsessed with cider. You’ll come away with a deeper appreciation for every effervescent, tart, or sweet sip, hearing directly from the growers, makers, and enthusiasts who are shaping this drink’s exciting present and future.
Author: Language: English Episodes: 501

Cider Chat
Podcast Episodes
099: Cider, Ètretat, & WWII | Normandy, France [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 56:54
Vincent Godefroy is one smart cidermaker located in Normandy France. He saw the opportunity to entice tourist visiting the nearby famous white cliffs of Ètretat to his cidery. Vincent and Marie-Clarie Godefroy have a ful…
098: Jérôme Dupont (1970-2018) Domaine Dupont | Normandy, FR [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 1:02:21
The Louis Dupont Family Estate is a 70 acre (30 hectares) orchard that was bought by selling the family's stock of calvados. In this chat I speak with Jérome Dupont the great grandson of Jules Dupont who bought Domaine D…
097: Cider Chat Travels in Europe | Normandy [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 47:13
In this chat I take you along on my travels a.k.a reconnaissance for a future travel tourist trips to Normandy. This main chat begins at 12:30 minutes Before I headed to France I first made a stop in the Netherlands, spe…
096: Finger Lakes Cider House | New York [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 1:18:03
This episode of Cider Chat was recorded by Alex Kroh, cidermaker, roving podcast reporter and super, duper nice guy in Ciderville! This chat begins with Alex and Melissa and Garett venturing outside to the orchard and th…
095: Cider Making at Home easy as 1-2-3 [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 49:10
Making a 1-gallon batch of cider is easy! And a 3-gallon or 5-gallon batch of cider is just as easy to make too! Learn how to make cider at home and begin upping your cider knowledge today. In this episode I cover all th…
094: Discovering Luxembourg w/Ramborn Cider Co [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 49:43
Ramborn Cider Company located in Luxembourg is helping to revive the cidermaking tradition as the country's first commercial cidery. Ramborn offers a range cider styles from Farmhouse, Somerset Blend (Luxembourg and Engl…
093: Orchard Care & Apple Storage w/Colin Scott | MA [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 1:12:44
Colin Scott grew up learning how to care for apples on his parents, Edward and Janice, orchard. The orchard was purchased in 1954. Today Colin is running the orchard and sells his apples at the Chelsea Market in eastern…
092: Brad Glover | Swilled Dog Hard Cider, West Virginia [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 55:09
Swilled Dog Hard Cider is a family owned cidery located in the Shenandoah Valley of West Virginia. Swilled Dog launched in January 2017, and and began selling its wares in March. This is the 2nd cider company to launch i…
091: In the Ciderhouse w/Eve's Cidery | NY [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 1:01:30
Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts. If you missed part I of this chat (episode 90) with Eve's Cidery, you'll want to go back and listen as we tour the orchard with Autumn Stoscheck a…
090: Eve's Cidery - Orchard Walk | New York [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 55:34
Guest Podcaster and cidermaker, Alex Kroh, bring us into the orchard at Eve's Cidery. This episode 90 is Part 1 of a two-part show with the makers at this New York State cidery! Find Part 2 when it goes live next week on…