365:  A Fantastical Indescribable Drink | Cider

365: A Fantastical Indescribable Drink | Cider

Author: Ria Windcaller: Award-winning Cidermaker, Podcaster | Craft Beer Columnist April 19, 2023 Duration: 59:29

Is Cider Truly Indescribable?

There isn't one definitive language or lexicon for cider, which adds to its indescribable mystique. The ongoing debate around what cider is or isn't or should be doesn't help. It certainly feels like a present day problem defining cider, but is it? Or has this debate been going on for years?

To help us get to the root of this indescribable dilemma, we are featuring "A Systematic Approach to Tasting Cider" as presented by Richie Brady at CiderCon 2023, an annual trade conference hosted by the American Cider Association. This is Richie's second appearance on Cider Chat. We first heard about his research on the lexicon of cider in Episode 286: A Living Language of Cider.

Richie provides a road map, complete with historical references and present day trends that helps us sort through this indescribable mess!

Episode 365 Richie Brady presenting at CiderCon 300x200 Richie Brady presenting at CiderCon 2023

In this indescribable Chat

  • Richie Brady's background
  • Difficulties in describing taste: Language
  • Proposed Systematic Approach to Tasting Cider
  • Considering Cider's Lexicon

Episode 365 slide 9 on difficulty of describing cider 300x200

Mentions in this Chat

  • @Sabatinis_Bottleshop - has a tasting room and served Domain Dupont Pommeau
  • April 28th Kickoff Party - EsoTerra Ciderworks
  • Fermentis - Yeast and Fermentation Solutions for Cidermakers
  • Subscribe to eCiderNews

Haven't downloaded this episode yet? Here it is again for your listening pleasure.


There’s a whole world in a glass of cider, and Cider Chat is your invitation to explore it. Hosted by award-winning cidermaker and writer Ria Windcaller, this podcast travels far beyond the bottle to meet the people who make the global cider culture so vibrant. Each conversation is a journey-you might find yourself in a heritage orchard learning the history of forgotten apple varieties, in a bustling taproom with an importer explaining regional traditions, or in a kitchen with a chef pairing cider with unexpected foods. The discussions get into the delightful nuances, too, whether that’s the semantics of what we even call this drink or how the concept of terroir translates from soil to sip. It’s not just about production; it’s about the community, the travel, and the stories that fermentation unlocks. This is for anyone curious about the craft, history, and sheer enjoyment of fermented apple juice in all its forms. So, pour a glass and settle in for a series that feels like a wide-ranging, informative, and genuinely good-humored chat with friends who happen to be obsessed with cider. You’ll come away with a deeper appreciation for every effervescent, tart, or sweet sip, hearing directly from the growers, makers, and enthusiasts who are shaping this drink’s exciting present and future.
Author: Language: English Episodes: 501

Cider Chat
Podcast Episodes
347: High Desert Apples | Calico Cidery, CA [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 1:04:35
Everything is Right Side Up at Calico The logo of Calico Cidery might be an upside down apple drawn to look like an apple tree, but the setting, the people, orchard and the cider is all right side up and slamming it! Loc…
346: Gnarly Pippins on Why Pomological Exhibits Matter [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 58:25
What is a pomological exhibition? Orchardist Matt Kaminsky has hosted a Pomological Exhibition in Ashfield, Massachusetts for the past 3 years. In this talk recorded at the Cider Pop-UP as part of CiderDays 2.0 events on…
345: Co-Fermenting Cider & Beer | Four Phantoms Brewery, MA [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 48:42
Four Phantoms Looks to Historical Co-Ferments Head Brewer and owner Drew Phillips of Four Phantoms Brewery in Greenfield Massachusetts spoke on Folks Traditions and the Co-Fermentation of Wort and Apple Juice and the bre…
344: Ciders that are Playing with Aging | Ragged Hill Cider, MA [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 52:30
Cider on the Table like Fine Wine at Ragged Hill Steve Garwood and daughter Anne Garwood Hampp are the mastermind duo at Ragged Hill Cider based in West Brookfield, Massachusetts. They brought a selection of bottles to t…
343: Volunteers are the Engine of the Event | CiderDays 2.0 Part 3 [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 40:44
Volunteering for CiderDays, Since 1994 On the first ever CiderDays, which was a one day event held on November 5, 1994, volunteers were stationed at local cider mills to encourage people to learn how to make cider. When…
341: Going to CiderDays 2.0 | Tip of the Glass Part 1 [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 48:24
Going to CiderDays 2.0 | Part 1 This year 2022 is the reboot of America's oldest educational and festive cider event dubbed this year as CiderDays 2.0 and this episode we tip the glass to those who are helping make it ha…
340: Eric Bordelet on Pairing Cider with Food [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 40:09
How to Pair Cider with Food "One must taste, taste, taste to know." say maker Eric Bordelet when pairing food with cider. Yes, it is not as simple as seeing the menu, but also knowing how both the Chefs in the kitchen an…
339: On the Bus with the French Cider Tour | Part 2 [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 55:28
Why a Cider Tour Bus is better than going Solo The obvious reason why taking a bus tour vs driving on your own to visit French cidermakers is that you can imbibe! But wait there is more! In this episode 339, the guest on…
338: Audio Snap Shots from French Cider Tour | Part 1 [not-audio_url] [/not-audio_url]

Duration: 43:24
Normandy to Brittany on the French Cider Tour The 2022 French Cider Tour that took travelers from across North America on a trip of a life time was a trip of a life time. Not only were the apple and pear trees laden with…